"You can't do everything on your own.", Dr. Jeff Williamson’s Entrepreneurial Evolution

Discover the seamless blend of faith and business acumen with Dr. Jeff Williamson, founder of Converge Group Inc., as he regales us with his transition from academia to entrepreneurship. Together, we unpack the essence of balancing a hectic entrepreneurial lifestyle with personal commitments, all through a Christian lens. Dr. Williamson's journey is a testament to the power of relationships and the natural evolution of a side project into a thriving enterprise, where passion acts as the fuel that propels us forward. His practical advice is a treasure trove for anyone looking to manage their time efficiently while juggling career and new business aspirations.

Ever wondered how leaders make letting go look so effortless? This episode peels back the curtain on the art of delegation, revealing how trusting others with tasks can skyrocket productivity and lead to remarkable outcomes. Learn from our experiences at the Converge conference and in podcasting where embracing the unique strengths of each team member not only yields better results but also cultivates an enjoyable and synergistic workspace. It's a reminder that sometimes, stepping back is the bravest step forward in allowing our projects and people to flourish.

Cap off your listening experience with a surge of inspiration about self-belief and the grit to seize entrepreneurial opportunities. We share stories of success that sprouted from taking chances and underscore the tactics that can foster both professional and personal growth. Whether it's journaling or effective note-taking, these strategies are game-changers for building stronger connections and maintaining accountability. Make sure to connect with Jeff through the Converge network or learn more about the entrepreneurial resources offered at the McGraw School of Business for an enriching journey at the nexus of faith and commerce.

To connect with Olivet’s Entrepreneurship Program, contact Program Director, Chris Perez at caperez2@olivet.edu.

To learn more about other entrepreneurship opportunities and the McGraw School of Business’s very own Createur Conference and Pitch Competition, go to Createur.Olivet.edu.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

This week, Jeff Williamson will be joining us to share some useful tips and tricks on how to effectively manage your time as an entrepreneur.

Speaker 2: 0:07

Where faith and business meet. This is Creator. What does it mean to be a Christian entrepreneur? How can I turn my ideas into an actual business? How do I navigate my path to entrepreneurship?

Speaker 1: 0:20

Welcome to Creator, the podcast brought to you by Olivet Nazarene University's McGraw School of Business to unlock the secrets to Christian entrepreneurship and fuel your path to success.

Speaker 2: 0:31

I'm your host, Carly Bird, graduate assistant of Olivet's Entrepreneurship Program.

Speaker 1: 0:37

I'm your co-host, Spencer James, an Olivet undergraduate marketing management and business administration major.

Speaker 2: 0:42

Join us, fellow students, as we embark on a journey to discover the call of the entrepreneur.

Speaker 1: 0:49

Hello everyone. This week, carly and I are thrilled to have someone who has grown to be quite beloved by all of that community.

Speaker 2: 0:55

Dr Jeff Williamson is the founder of Converge Group Inc. An executive coaching and people development practice. Prior to launching his business in 2017, he was a dean executive director and professor of organizational leadership, serving in higher education for 30 years. He is the host of Leadership Level Up podcast and regularly teaches and speaks to business and industry on topics such as personal leadership, leadership paradigms, leading change and discovering your own strengths. Jeff, thank you so much for being here today. It's so great to have you in the studio.

Speaker 3: 1:29

Thank you for having me. It's always good when I can be here at Olivet and make some new friends, so let's go.

Speaker 2: 1:36

Exactly, I know it's so great to finally meet you. You know, like I said and Spencer mentioned, I see your name pop up quite a bit when it comes to Olivette, but I hadn't had the chance to meet you yet in person and I was so surprised with the amount of times that we almost cross paths but just don't quite make it, so it's good to I know, so it's so good that we're all here together.

Speaker 2: 1:57

Finally and yeah, this is so exciting. So you know, as I mentioned, jeff, you are certainly one busy individual, based on that speaker bio. We just went over there and, as our listeners know from some of the previous episodes of Creator that we've had, running your own business is certainly a task that takes up an enormous amount of time and energy. I mean, you have to be fully prepared to dive into owning a business and, you know, taking care of all the needs that come along with that. So I'm just going to dive right in. When you were getting ready to take some of those steps with Converge, what were some of those ways that maybe you made room or adjusted your schedule, because this was certainly a new big endeavor to take on? How did you find that you were able to adjust that time calendar to make room for this big endeavor?

Speaker 3: 2:44

Yeah, it's now been eight years ago that I started the business, but at the time I was still serving in Olivet, working full time, so that makes for evenings and weekends getting really important to knock out things for your business, which is ongoing as well.

Speaker 3: 3:01

I would do things like pre-record videos, pre-record clips that I was going to schedule and drop on social media, and so I would bundle up those kinds of things together in a focused amount of time and try to get those knocked out while I was away from my other job.

Speaker 3: 3:20

So I often say, though, that it's kind of like the old saying of like, if you love what you're doing, it doesn't feel like, oh man, I got to go, because the work that I've been able to do in building this company and building client base, it's really just grounded in relationships, and I often said for years, relationships are everything, and so, whatever the profession is, if you start there, that's so key to everything, because you're taking care of people, no matter what the company does, no matter what service you provide, and so I guess for me it just kind of flowed out of who I am and who I want to be that you know if people need some support or need some guidance or need some training on something, if I can speak into that and help their journey, I would not want to do that.

Speaker 2: 4:12

It's a great point. Yeah, I love that Doing something that you're passionate about and that you love and, as you mentioned, sometimes when you're in that field, it shouldn't feel like you're working too hard per se. It should be something you love and you're passionate about and care about, so it should feel good. There's those hard times too, as all entrepreneurs know that, but there should definitely be some love and enjoyment of what you're doing.

Speaker 1: 4:36

Yeah, one of the things that we've heard from some other guests on the show is finding that balance between working a full-time job and then also going out and starting a new endeavor. I mean, was that something that you had to kind of figure out as you went? I mean, did you have any mentors or people that kind of helped you figure?

Speaker 3: 4:51

that out. Yeah, for sure. I mean by intention. I wanted to do kind of a slow build because I was doing it as a side gig. But from the beginning I approached it thinking, okay, at some point when this grows I'm going to step away from my career in higher ed. But then what I'm doing is I'm still teaching and educating and investing in people. So it's really not that much different in some ways than when I was a prof or when I was doing corporate relations work. So it just felt pretty natural to me that the work that I'm doing now and I love my work in higher ed too, so don't get me wrong, but the work that I'm doing now just feels the most me of anything I've ever done.

Speaker 1: 5:30

And kind of with that. I mean, are there some techniques or approaches that you would maybe recommend for other people that who are kind of starting out on that right? We have some even young professionals right, who have maybe just graduated college and are kind of navigating what that looks like.

Speaker 3: 5:45

We talked some about time and managing all that, and that's part of the bundle is figuring out when do I have time available, when can I make time available? Because I can talk all day about how much time we have and where it goes and all those kinds of things. But if a person commits to building something new, business or whatever, they really have to identify how much time they're willing to give to it and not just say, well, I'm going to incorporate and see what happens. Okay, you got to have some plans, you got to have some ideas and goals where you want to be and when you're going to, how you're going to get there and what's the timeline that you're shooting for. And so those kinds of things are just always percolating in my mind.

Speaker 3: 6:31

And you know I was looking back to some notes. I've journaled for years and I was looking back at an old journal from back like 15 years ago and in that I'd gone to a conference where they're kind of giving you some time to say do some dreaming, what would you love most to do? And I looked back and it was like I said work for myself, consult, speak, teach, train. I would have said that I wanted to do that for 10 years. But when I looked at the journal and the dates, it was like 15 years ago that I was going man one of these days and I just got tired of one of those days and I said I'm going to incorporate, I'm going to file my paperwork and make this a thing, because for me, that was my impetus to go. Okay, this is a real organization of me, but it's on the books. The state of Illinois says this is a business and now let's go. So that inspired me to just like take action, I'm attack, I'm a take action guy. Attack the plan and go.

Speaker 1: 7:40

So you started out right, you make it legal. I mean, were there distractions in that process? I mean, how did you handle all the many inputs that come in at the same time all at once, those people so as.

Speaker 3: 7:50

I was getting ready to do this and be more intentional about it. I bought different people lunch and a cup of coffee and said, okay, I'm doing this thing and I'm not just pretending I'm going to do it. Well, I'm going to do it right. What do I need to know, friend who's an attorney? What do I need to know, friend who started a ministry 20 years ago? You know? So I, before I really got into the action of it, I was talking to people who knew what it was like and knew some of the things that I might run into, and so that that really helped me a lot, cause I didn't, even though I was like, okay, I started a business and it's just me. At that point I didn't feel like I was doing this alone and that was so key.

Speaker 1: 8:45

I've seen that or heard of that model before, and I think it's a really, really powerful one, and sometimes it can be kind of a jokingly one, right oh, who's on my board, right, you know, and so I can kind of see it. But it's so powerful, right, and to have so many different perspectives for what you're trying to do is you're really just key in that, so that's awesome, yeah, cause you know.

Speaker 3: 9:04

And that same group of people have been other times where I've gone to them and said, hey, I need your feedback on this, I'm thinking about this or I wonder about doing this and am I nuts? Yeah, or is that just crazy, or out of my lane or whatever. And when that's people that have known you 10, 15, 20 years some of them, you know, I have three older brothers, so I've always had them as kind of my first board of directors to say is this nuts? And they'd be like, yeah, maybe you know, or no, no, you can do it. Go for it, man, you can do that.

Speaker 2: 9:40

You got to have those people. That's right yeah can do that.

Speaker 3: 9:45

You got to have those people. That's right. Yeah, I mean, none of us do. Whatever we do alone we do, we're probably destined for failure, because we're made for community. We're not made to do whatever we're doing alone or or feeling alone. I was just on a webinar earlier today and they were talking about the pandemic of loneliness. Oh, yes.

Speaker 3: 10:02

I thought oh man, I am seeing that so much, Even in leaders. You know, when I do quite a bit of executive coaching and the most common thing I hear from CEOs who work with me is at some point, usually in the first two or three weeks, they'll say my gosh, I don't have anybody that I can talk to about this stuff. And it's such a good thing for them to say, wow, I have a neutral third party who has my best interest. That doesn't work for me or that isn't on my board or my board chair, and they can just throw ideas and kind of whiteboard things. And then they have this safe space, listening ear, and that's. I often say that, whether they're believers or not, I'll say to them man, that's holy ground. Thank you for sharing that with me. So they're not alone if they're building a business or switching to a new career and that kind of thing.

Speaker 1: 10:55

I've heard that model too a lot is the lonely leader. I read a book on it called the Lonely Leader, and it's something that a lot of times leaders don't know that they're lonely until they are and they don't encounter it until they're feeling rock bottom. So that's really true.

Speaker 3: 11:10

I've seen that again and again. A few years back I did a video I just called the isolation of leadership. It's the same idea is oh okay? Well, I can't really spill this idea. I'm kicking around with my sports Right, because they'll flip out. Maybe I can't necessarily just go to my board, chair my board and say, hey, I'm thinking about starting a new product, what do you guys think? And have them go? What Exactly? So they don't have anybody they can sort that out.

Speaker 3: 11:47

And again, I'm a neutral third party, so I can go. Man, that seems like a pretty good idea. What are you going to do with that? Or who's going to be your client, or who's going to be your ideal customer? And we go down that pathway.

Speaker 2: 11:54

Definitely, and as you're mentioning how important it is to surround yourself with the right people, I want to switch almost a little bit to the people within your organization as well. I think that another issue and that this kind of relates back to time management as well is, if you're going to be able to manage your time, you also have to know how to delegate to those people that are surrounding you in that organization. With you, you're supposed to be a team, as we know. One person can't do this alone. It's just not going to happen as much as we can try, and trust me, I've been there myself.

Speaker 2: 12:22

Sometimes, you know you think that you can do it all, but you need to be able to trust people around you and find the right people to surround yourself with, even within that company, of course. It's so crucial. Do you think you could give some tips or advice? Maybe that you've learned through your time as an entrepreneur, specifically that's helped you when it comes to delegating and learning how to learn those ropes, because that's something that I mean it's a skill you have to learn. You don't just magically learn how to teach yourself. You know it takes time to learn that skill, but what are some tricks or ways you've found to delegate.

Speaker 3: 12:52

First of all, true confessions. It took me too long to figure that out, that it's like I don't have to know how to do everything to be a good leader, and so you know, I think some of the ways that I've had to adapt and love to adapt now is it takes so much pressure off me to not try to be everything right, and so, as we've done different things, you know, like when we a couple of years ago started a Converge conference, it was kind of a brand promotional event that we wanted to bring the community together.

Speaker 3: 13:22

Well, you can't bring in a hundred people and film it and record the audio and line up speakers and line up food and line up all that stuff. I'm not up to that. So many people on our crew contributed to making that happen and so it's like Christmas morning and I just get to be the host, right. So events are certainly those kinds of things where I'm just like good Lord, what would I do without these people?

Speaker 2: 13:49

You're speaking my language.

Speaker 3: 13:52

Yeah, so so that's one. You know the the conference event that we do every fall, and then another one. I've gotten into podcasting the last year, year and a half, and that's another space. I jokingly told you guys, although I'm totally serious when I came and I said this is cool, all this tech. I just sit down and talk to people and that's that's what we do on our show too, is I invite interesting people in to talk to me and ask them questions, and then I try not to get in the way and we have off.

Speaker 3: 14:25

You know we do video and audios. We have I have somebody who's recording, I have somebody who's listening to the audio and they're behind the scenes kind of going yeah, it's good, or wait a minute, can you repeat that part that we didn't pick that up? And if it would just be me talking to my phone without them, right, and so their abilities, the things that they're terrific at, like capturing video or capturing sound, and then going and edit, and then some different people on our team edit that for us. So for every episode that goes out, there's like four or five different people that touch that before it drops on social media and says, hey, check it out, and I'm a recipient of that.

Speaker 2: 15:09

Yeah, I never knew how much we would have in common. You're talking about podcasts and events and I'm like, oh yes, I completely agree. And you know, I think and I have to admit this is certainly something that you know, I'm certainly working on as well it's definitely, you know, a task you have to learn over time. But it's good to know that everybody should have their expertise too. You don't have to know everything or have your hands in everything and think that you have to be perfect at every single task, because that's not going to happen. But when you find what you're good at, like you're saying, when someone's good at editing, shout out to Spencer also, by the way, a co-host right here Are you, mr Editor.

Speaker 2: 15:45

Yes, he is. So shout out right there over here, buddy, but there's going to be someone who is very gifted at editing and that is their strong suit, and you shouldn't even touch it because that is something that you don't know anything Me, I don't know anything about that. There's going to be someone who is doing the video or what about writing the script. You know all those pieces like you're saying that go into something and same with a business. Of course, everyone's got their strengths and something that that's what they've been doing their whole life and this is something they love to do. And you need to find those people like you're saying that that's their strong suit and they're the expert to help you along the way.

Speaker 3: 16:20

Yeah, and I I guess you know, as I've been around longer than the two of you combined, probably um is to learn what joy there can be and letting other people take those different pieces and shine. As you were describing that, I was thinking back to our fall conference. We integrate music and stuff, so we have like walk-up songs and walk away songs and what song we're going to play on the breaks and what song we're going to play right before we call them back, you know. And so our guy Logan, he put that all together and selected that, and when he and I met and talked about it, I just said, dude, you pick them out. You know the only one.

Speaker 3: 16:57

I had one request, and that was when we were bringing him back from the breaks. I wanted to do shout, you know, kick my ass. I said I want that because people will hear that and go oh, I got to move now. But the rest of it, I said, just surprised me. Just pick them out, put them in there. And it was fantastic, and I knew it would be, because that's his jam, he's a musician, you know, he knows that stuff, and so that was just. That was a good reminder to say. Here's what I want to feel like. Here's what I want it to look like no-transcript. And it was just like it's off my shoulders, yeah Right. And he had a ball doing it.

Speaker 1: 17:40

That's fun. I've been asking people this last week what they think that their most productive day of the week is, and it's just kind of been a question I've been curious about. Right, I interact with people. We're kind of in a season right now where it's like grind time Right as a student and you're like put your head down right and get it done, and so it's been something really interesting to me like asking what is your most productive day? And so I hear answers from all over the place, right, and so I guess maybe that's my question for you what do you think your most productive day is and how do you just lock in and channel right and be able to focus in and be able to manage your day effectively?

Speaker 3: 18:16

Yeah, I think for me, my most productive day is when it's not at company meetings, when it's not Now. We need those. Those are fine. But my most productive days for me, what brings me the real joy, is the day that I have maybe two, three coaching clients and then I have a meeting with someone who's thinking about working with us and by doing that that's tapping into the me being the best me possible, because the those coaching conversations they bring life and energy to me, let alone what I'm supposed to be doing for them. And so I think my most productive days are when I'm able to interact with other people who I'm trying to help grow and develop.

Speaker 1: 19:03

Yeah, and I mean, that probably obviously gives you energy, right? Oh, it does.

Speaker 3: 19:08

Like level up and fuel up, right, yeah, yeah, I mean, anybody that's known me for five minutes kind of figures out. I'm not an introvert. And so people was like, oh man, you had a really long day, you must be exhausted. I'm like, no, I'm totally jacked because I had, you know, this and this and this, and then I went to this lunch event and then I got to spend time with someone. I'm just my cup's running over, you know. And so, because that's where my energy flows from, it's not like I'm exhausted, I gotta go home, yeah, you know. It's like how am I going to sleep tonight? This was such a good day.

Speaker 1: 19:42

Yeah, yeah, that's awesome. Well, we also like to ask some of our guests this question and, uh, it's something that we really like hearing different answers from different people. But I mean, what if you could just give one piece of advice to, to and to students and even prospective students who are looking to go into entrepreneurship? I mean, what would be your one biggest and greatest piece of advice for?

Speaker 3: 20:06

them that on yourself. I think we can get caught up in wait and see, wait and see. I have this idea. I was guilty of that. I wish I would have started so much sooner with doing this thing that I'm doing now. And so I would say, bet on yourself. If you have an idea and you're passionate about it and you're willing to do the hard work and to be in the trenches, maybe by yourself, for a while, and build this thing that you know people need, then go for it, Don't wait. Last week I was on a call with some group things group mentoring stuff and one of the people on that call is a graduate of yours. I won't throw her out there on air, but you may want to talk to her, because she graduated from here I don't know five, six years ago and started her own business three years ago I think it was, and she's doing so great and didn't know at the front end what this was going to look like, but she did it anyway. And so bet on yourself. Don't let fear hold you back.

Speaker 1: 21:15

Yeah, there's time management and not waiting. Right, yeah, yeah, that's time management and not waiting right.

Speaker 3: 21:19

Yeah, yeah, that's time management right there.

Speaker 1: 21:21

Wait for what yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2: 21:23

I completely agree. You know, actually really quick. I just want to go back to earlier. This just caught my attention really quickly. You mentioned your journaling and your journals from past conferences you went to and I found that so interesting.

Speaker 2: 21:37

Do you have any advice for these students or attendees as they're taking notes, or how do they take effective notes? Because I think that's one issue where sometimes we'll go to these conferences, we'll, you know, write things down and then you just never use it, you never look at it again. Yeah, and these are some really good tips and advice you're getting. You know, how do you go about journaling Cause it sounds like you have a really good grasp on this from, I mean, you've said, a journal from 15 years ago, I mean well, first of all is like I write things down, assuming that at some point I'll come back to this and I may not remember everything.

Speaker 3: 22:11

So today, everybody I met with today, I put the date, I put their name, I put the topic of what the meeting was you know, it's coaching to what is the day 20, 21st, whatever, and um. So I put that factual stuff down so that that I'll be able to go back and go. Let's see, it's kind of this historical register sort of. You know, wow, um but.

Speaker 2: 22:33

But yeah, I mean, there's been times where I thought oh, I gotta read.

Speaker 3: 22:36

I'm gonna go back and check that and I can go look at my little stack and go. I think that was two journals ago. That's cool, go back and find the, you know whatever. But for me it's, besides, just those factual information of who did I meet with, and what we talk about is, if they say something that I don't want to forget, I write it down. Or every once in a while I'll say something I don't want to forget.

Speaker 2: 22:59

You know, like oh that was good.

Speaker 3: 23:01

I should, I should put that down. But I do a lot of bullet points in those kinds of things, you know, so that I at least have a summary and who it was and when it was. And then if I if it's something really important, I need to go back, I can say hey, spencer, we talked like six months ago, but I had a question about what you're doing now. I was looking at my notes and could you remind me what you're doing with that? It just gives me a way to connect back and keep that history moving. So I'm a super big believer in, you know, reflective journaling.

Speaker 1: 23:33

I love that. I mean, there's a sense of accountability there, right? There's also a sense maybe for some people who are on the other end of that that are like whoa, how'd you remember that, right? Well, yeah, you weren't supposed to remember that.

Speaker 3: 23:44

It gives me a little intel. I mean, we look smarter than I am, but I love capturing those things and I almost brought mine in today because I thought, well, man, they might say something. So this is a rare time that I don't have a journal. So literally everywhere I go in the workday I've got my bag with my journal in it, and if I'm meeting with somebody I'm usually got my. You know, like you, I've got my journal open and I'm ready. If something comes up, I can just punch it in, cause that's different than oh, you say something really brilliant and I'm pecking on my phone and you're like, what are you doing, dude? But if I'm writing it down, I'll just say, man, say that again. I want to make sure I get that right. That's a different piece than kind of going. Oh wait, I'm going to put that in my Evernotes, you know.

Speaker 2: 24:28

Yep, I'm a little guilty of that sometimes, but I have to admit it. There's something about actually writing it down to that physical handwritten note. I know that sounds old school but it's true. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 24:39

I think there's some connectivity to our neuro whatever neurological room. I don't even know what I'm talking about.

Speaker 2: 24:48

No, I know that. Shout out to Prof Perez, out there too he's. He's always making fun of me because he'll turn and see me. And as he's giving me a list of items, I'm over here, like you said, my thumb's going a million miles, and he's like, what are you doing? I'm like, oh, I'm taking my rapid notes on the phone. But yeah, there is something to say about the physical paper copy notes.

Speaker 3: 25:07

It does yeah.

Speaker 2: 25:09

Well, oh my goodness, this has been such a great conversation for all of us. You know me and Spencer as well. You've watched the podcast before. I don't know if you remember this piece, but at the end we always end with a quirky question of the week. It's kind of our thing, I know it's. It's kind of cracking me up. A few of our guests on here now they're like it's quirky question time. Now I'm like yeah, I'm like all right my brain is spinning trying to predict where are they going with this?

Speaker 3: 25:30

I'm like it's okay I'm. I'm a pretty good off the cuff guy, so all right.

Speaker 2: 25:35

Spencer, I feel like I've given them a lot recently. So, spencer, how about you go for it?

Speaker 1: 25:39

All right, I'll ask your quirky question. Here it is If you could teach a course on any topic you wanted, what would it be and why?

Speaker 2: 25:47

So even outside of the box, just anything.

Speaker 3: 25:51

I think in our society, one of the things I referenced earlier in the call is a pandemic of loneliness. I think if I could teach one class to anybody and everybody, it would be how to authentically connect with people for real and to not be fearful of what's going to happen. When I step into that, I'm discomfort of that, and so I've so value relationships and I always say relationships are everything. I think I want that for everybody, so that would probably be the content of the class. The other part was who would I want to be in that? Yeah, I just see so many people across the age span struggling with that. You know it isn't just you, kids and your phone.

Speaker 2: 26:35

You know it's not just that.

Speaker 3: 26:37

I see people my age, I see people in their forties or whatever that they just they don't know how to look in each other's eyes and have a conversation. That makes you feel like you're somebody and you matter. And if we could do that for each other, what a wonderful world that would be. So I guess that's maybe a little more serious answer, but that's kind of where my heart went. I'm just like I want people to know how to be real together and know the joy of that happening and not being fearful and hesitant.

Speaker 1: 27:09

It's funny that you know they have the app called Be Real right, and I always laugh at the name of it. I'm like there's nothing real about snapping a photo on your phone right and scrolling through it, but it's kind of interesting. The real being real is in person, right, that's right, yeah.

Speaker 3: 27:21

Face to face. It is, man. I mean, if you think about how many people you know who are absolutely comfortable looking directly in the eyes and talking to you, right, and I think it's a smaller number than it needs to be. I'll just say that, yeah, I think it's a smaller number than it needs to be.

Speaker 2: 27:38

I'll just say that, yeah, I completely agree. I'm someone I absolutely love. I was a communication minor at undergrad and you know I absolutely love communicating and completely agree. It's something that everybody you know our society just seems to be lacking. We need better communication skills and, like you said, like right now, the three of us all communicating together in person, it's so invaluable the experiences.

Speaker 1: 28:02

It is Well. Thank you so much for for joining us today on the show. We went all around the circle. Right Leadership time management, betting on ourselves, even right. So we we want to thank you so much for for all the awesome insight you have. Thanks for having me, man. Yeah, appreciate it.

Speaker 2: 28:18

Yeah, this was such a great conversation and listeners. If you want to learn more about Converge or connect with Jeff, you can visit his website convergegroupio, or find him on LinkedIn under Dr Jeff Williamson.

Speaker 1: 28:31

And to connect with all of its entrepreneurship program director, chris Perez, or to discover other entrepreneurial opportunities that the program has to offer, such as the McGraw School of Business's very own creator conference and pitch competition. You can go to creatorolivetedu.

Speaker 2: 28:46

Thank you for listening everyone and don't forget to tune in next time.

Speaker 1: 28:50

Where faith and business meet. This is the Creator Podcast. We'll see you later. Thanks,